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Registered Nutter!
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Discussion Starter #1
As a few of you may know, i was the lucky guinea pig to test their 1st set of braided brake lines for the N/A.

I thought i would post this up for everyone as i'm starting to loose my paitence with them.

I recieved the set of front and rears on the 3rd December last year (2008).
Had alot going on so it took me 'til 13th January (2009) to get them fiited up.

All seemed well, rears looked fine but as we went to fit the fronts, we came up against quite a few problems.

Firstly, the banjo that fits onto the caliper on the R33 is straight, the one's on Conceptuas are bent meaning the lines won't fit and run in the right direction.
Turned out they had copied the end banjo's off an S13??? 'confirmed by Chris'
Secondly, the lines are a one piece and seem far too long.
Thirdly, there was no way of securing them so this would leave them hanging dangerously and they could get caught in the wheel etc causing all end of problems as you can imagine!!
The OEM one's are 2 piece and clamp up out the way so not to get caught etc.

I swiftly got back to Chris at Conceptua to report my findings.
He said 'great, that's exactly why they wanted them testing, to find out these things'.

I advised them on what alterations were needed as i'm City & Guilds trained in Brakes and my dad is a mechanic with 40 years experience, endless qualifications and a licenced M.O.T tester, so we both had plenty of input for them.

The reason i'm posting this is time and time again i have messaged Chris and i have been told that they are remanufacturing them and will send out the new one's in a couple of weeks, as i paid for the one's that are no good.
I keep getting told this and nothing ever comes of it, nor any updates on what's happening???

I still haven't got any!!??
I haven't been getting any replies back!!??

And the thing i'm most concerned with is, i told Chris that the old lines shouldn't be sold as obviously they won't fit properly, will be very dangerous if fitted up and get caught up which could potentially result in no brakes and god forbid someone losing there life!!
He said they were going to have the end banjo's changed and something to clamp them up made.

SO WHY THE HELL ARE THEY STILL BEING SOLD ON EBAY??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/R33-GTS-N-A-Skyline-RB25DE-Braided-Brake-Line-Set-Of-4_W0QQitemZ110336784589QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item110336784589&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72:1683|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

Why??????? there not safe to fit and use!!!!!

I feel like i am being constantly fobbed off, that their not actually remanufacturing them and just stalling me and i feel that their happy to carry on selling a dangerous product as it's still being advertised which is down right wrong!!

No doubt they will disagree and i hope they will respond to this thread and explain themselves!

All i can say is i'm pissed off!
Disappointed!

And PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, DO NOT BUY A SET!!!
 

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Administrator
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14,725 Posts
I've closed the thread and PM'd Chris and asked him to respond.
 

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Registered
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Tim,

Hi there- sorry if you feel we haven’t kept you up to date as much as you would have liked. We are a small company, and time is always our poorest resource.

However, you have always been promised the new Mk 2 versions of the lines as soon as they are available.

I would like to mention again that the original agreement was for you to trial the lines. This could potentially be easy, or difficult. The hassle factor is always a possibility with new products. As is usual for us, in return they were offered at a discount price, in this case you got the lines at half price. After the incorrect banjo fitment was raised (fair comment) as a small compensation you were offered free goods to the value of your investment. The offer still stands- so you are not out of pocket at all…

Regarding the length of time taken to get you the updated version, we received your comments in mid January (after you received the lines on the 3rd December).

We had a couple of weeks looking at and trialling different solutions, line locators, etc., with the manufacturers, exploring the simplest options first.

After that we decided to replicate the Nissan blocks as a more satisfactory solution, This probably takes us well into February.

There were manufacturing issues in that they could not easily make what we needed (i.e. for reasonable money- the original Nissan blocks are deceptively complex, and not easily replicated), so we had to work out a workable but achievable solution and make some design changes- by now another 2 weeks have passed. Its now past mid February

Once we were completely happy that we were not paying up front for a load of metal blocks that would be useless (possibly another week of reassurances) we were given an estimate of 5 weeks or so to get the new blocks into production ready for assembly

Another week or so is required to get the new custom made lines assembled and dispatched to us. So we are not far away- but it is much slower than you may think.

Regarding us still selling the GTS lines on eBay they are the same as out GTS-T lines which we have sold many of, just with GTS ends- which we got wrong first time round. That was the point of the 'test fit'- there might be issues!!
These lines are the same as Demon Tweeks, and a major Japanese tuning brand. Goodrich, Hel, Hose Solutions etc... will offer similar- I have not seen a 2 line front kit offered.

We have sold hundreds of the GTS-T lines. We know they will pass an MOT as customers have thanked us for getting their cars through with our lines…

Given our small size, and the difficulty of bringing a brand new product to market, and also integrating the production run into the manufacturers existing scheduling, I don't think we are doing too bad. I think we are less than a fortnight away from receiving the new line sets.

A manufacturing run like this is completely different from just getting some hoses made up with certain end fittings. It’s a big investment for us, and takes a lot of time to set up. To make the lines have an affordable price we have to order and pay for hundreds of the blocks up front. We certainly cannot afford to make a mistake and have hundreds of expensive but useless paperweights sat around.

Sorry if you feel you have not been kept as up to date as you wanted, but the hassle factor is inevitable with new products, and this one is particularly complcated and drawn out.
 

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Seasoned Member
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21,588 Posts
i have to agree with you Chris, in my expierence in "new designs/projects" it takes far longer than most would imagine to get the product perfect from the start, its a pain staking process of trial and error, as said "Rome wasn't built in a day" so it needs a bit of patience on both sides to get the part as near perfect as possible, and i'm even guilty of never responding as quick as i could of, its just a life habit most of us have yet never admit it lol, How i see it is once the product is ready for production many of us will benefit so its all thanks to you and Tim to go through the painstaking stage of development to move this forward to the production line, i'm sure the guys here will see the proof of what you guys are achieving and be grateful for the time and effort yr putting in even though it runs yr patience thin, stick with it Tim/Chris it will be worth it in the end....keith
 

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Registered Nutter!
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Discussion Starter #7
Hi Chris,

I'm glad to hear back and accept your reply.
I apologise for jumping the gun and am glad at the response as you have always been good, especially in the fact of offering us N/A owners parts that other suppliers would ignore.

I think that lack of communication was the real problem here and if i was kept more up to date i wouldn't have needed to post this up.

I think i just felt ignored as PM's hadn't been answered and in some i had asked about price's on other products and to see other people's questions getting answered, i just thought i was being shonded away.

Should i expect to recieve some revised front lines when there ready?
Also, if your honuring what you said in regards to offering me products up to the value of, i do need a wheel bearing for the N/S/R if you stock them at all? :D
 

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Hi Tim,

sorry for the late reply- I see you have posted but we have been pretty decimated here on the staff front. Because of time restraints I think this is the first time in two or three days I have been able to get on the forum here....

First the Lovely Laura left us a fortnight ago : ( leaving us short staffed.

Then Simon (in packing and dispatch) went to McDonalds (bad move admittably) and has been off for a week with food poisoning!!

Now Karen is not well either! (not through any fault of McDonalds!)

So apart from the (normal for us) 100 hour weeks we have been trying to do the work of two other people.

Please remember we get over 80 or 90 enquiries per day, so even one days delay in admin is a huge backlog- and it just gets worse the longer the backlog. So we may not be replying as quick as we might...

Anyway-

Regarding the lines- YES- you will most certainly get a set of new R33 GTS lines as soon as they are availble!

The 'test fit' you agreed to (with all its problems) coincided with our intention to make a second set of lines available which closer match the complicated Nissan originals. We will be making Braided Lines that mirror the original Nissn lines more closely.

I have checked out every supplier I can think of and NOBODY manufactures these kind of lines.

AFAIK Every supplier of aftermarket Skyline Braided Brake Lines provides lines that are free in length and do not have the Nissan style mounting block half way.

In addition NOBODY makes brake lines for the R33 GTS. Only the GTS-T....

For a small new company (was only four of us, now temporarlily three) I would like to think we are doing our best to assist GTS owners.

What might seem like a simple task- i.e make the Nissan style 'blocks' in the centre of the line run, is in fact very difficult.

There are an absolute multitude of rivers to cross.

It isn't just about solving the engineering barriers. I could commision a run of exact copies of the Nissan blocks very quickly.

BUT that would not mean they provide good value for our customers. We have to engineer lines that overcome the difficulties inherant in small run production to provide solid engineering combined with the best value possible.

With a safety related item like brake lines this isn't as easy as one might expect...

With the GTS non turbo lines I have just had a week long back and forth email run, phone calls, and personal visits to the manufacturers to discuss one tiny aspect which might seem insigificant.

Please remember with all the other things we are trying to do for Skyline owners we have to put the money up front to have a (not inexpensive) minimum run of the new blocks that will replicate the original Nissan lines more faithfully.

So they need to be right.

Bearing in mind how busy we are I can't think how we could get them out any quicker.

I have a sample of the new Skyline lines just in today. If just in sample form- i.e. not for retail. They look nice but there is a lot of work to do.

We wil be dispatching a set to you as soon as we can obtain a retail set.

Thanks for your input on the development.

Regards

Chris

Should i expect to recieve some revised front lines when there ready?
Also, if your honuring what you said in regards to offering me products up to the value of, i do need a wheel bearing for the N/S/R if you stock them at all? :D
Plenty on the shelf- when would you like one?
 

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The GTS uses the exact same suspension as a GTS-t, so other than the slightly different caliper attachment, the lines should be the same. So why the need to make blocks?
 

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tdi power
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13,297 Posts
because people then have the option on a single line on the front which is longer than oem one and has no block or they can fit thetwo line kit which has the block in the middle

the block option would be handy if you have more lock and dont want the hoses close to the tyre
 
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